How to Believe in a Pre-Trib Rapture

head_up_assHave you ever seen those guys that can bend over so far they can almost stick their head up their behind? That’s what we have to do to believe in a pre-trib rapture.

Pre-tribbers take scriptures that are obviously describing the rapture and claim it is not about the rapture. Then they take scriptures that make no mention of the rapture and claim it is all about the rapture. They are spreading confusion and need to stop.

One of their favorite explanations is the idea that the church is raptured in Revelation 4:1 and then never seen again until Revelation 19, which they claim proves we are all out of here before the tribulation starts. It sounds great, if only it was true. This post shows why it is false.

Pre-tribbers also make many other false claims, but this is just a blog post, not a book. So the scope of this post is limited to exposing the false teaching about Revelation 4:1 and their claim that believers are nowhere to be found after verse 4:1 until Revelation 19.

After these things I looked, and behold, a door standing open in heaven, and the first voice which I had heard, like the sound of a trumpet speaking with me, said, “Come up here, and I will show you what must take place after these things. (Revelation 4:1)

This verse describes how John was shown a vision of the throne of God in heaven. Notice there is no mention of the church being caught up to heaven. There is not even any mention that John was caught up to heaven. He explains in verse 2 he saw these things “in the Spirit”. There is no mention his physical body was caught up into the sky, which is what happens in the rapture. There is a big difference between seeing things in the Spirit and being physically caught up in the air and given a new body, immortal and imperishable, which is what happens in the rapture (1 Corinthians 15:51-57).

Notice the reason why he was caught up to heaven, so he could be shown “what must take place after these things.” The purpose for his heavenly vision is clearly stated. It was all about giving John revelation of things to happen in the future. His vision continues in the verses that follow, giving us an unmistakably clear explanation of why he was shown this vision. On the other hand, the purpose for the rapture has nothing to do with being shown the future. The rapture is a rescue operation to deliver God’s people from the wrath of God, which is poured out during the great tribulation (1 Thessalonians 1:10).

So despite the facts that Revelation 4:1 makes no mention of the church being raptured and clearly explains the purpose for John’s vision is to reveal the future, which is not the purpose for the rapture, the pre-tribbers claim this is one of their foundational pillars proving the pre-trib rapture. I suppose we have to keep bending over further to see it.

Here is an actual comment posted on this blog recently by a pre-tribber attempting to explain Revelation 4:1:

The first voice John heard was that of Christ coming to gather his people. John then after that, shifts the topic to the tribulation and we do not see the Church on earth again until Revelations 19 when Christ returns to take His reign.

John said the first voice he heard was “speaking with me,” which means the voice was speaking with John, not to the angels who are the ones who gather the saints in the rapture, and not to the whole church, who would be taken in the rapture, but just to John. Since there is no mention of the church this verse cannot be about the rapture of the church. This was a revelation given to John about the future. That’s it. Claiming this is Christ coming to gather his people is, well, you know.

But wait, it gets worse, much worse. Having established this verse as their foundational proof, they then try to build on it by claiming there are no more mentions of any believers on earth anywhere in the book of Revelation after verse 4:1 until near the end of the book in chapter 19. Unfortunately, this claim is also false. I suppose as long as their foundation is pure crap why not pile more crap on top of it?

Believers are clearly mentioned in Revelation chapters 6, 7, and 14. In Revelation 6 we find multitudes of believers who have been murdered for their faith.

When he opened the fifth seal, I saw under the altar the souls of those who had been slaughtered for the word of God and for the testimony they had given; they cried out with a loud voice, “Sovereign Lord, holy and true, how long will it be before you judge and avenge our blood on the inhabitants of the earth?” They were each given a white robe and told to rest a little longer, until the number would be complete both of their fellow servants and of their brothers and sisters, who were soon to be killed as they themselves had been killed.” (Revelation 6:9-11)

The breaking of the fifth seal releases great persecution of believers during the 42-month tribulation period. We know this happens during the tribulation because Jesus outlined the same events that John described in Revelation 6 and even listed them in the same order. By the time we get to the fifth seal we are in the tribulation.

Then they will deliver you to tribulation, and will kill you, and you will be hated by all nations because of My name. (Matthew 24:9)

When the fifth seal we see the souls of those who were slaughtered for the word of God and for their testimony. We are not told when they were killed, but we are told many more “were soon to be killed as they themselves had been killed.”

Question: If there are no believers on earth after Revelation 4:1 how is it possible for many believers to be killed for their faith just as these others had been killed?

Answer: It is not possible. Believers must be here on earth during the tribulation because otherwise it would be impossible for them to be killed for their faith. We are even told the method for killing many of them is beheading (Revelation 20:4). It is in the scriptures, so it is going to happen and it can only happen if the church is still here on earth.

Other scriptures support this slaughter of believers during the 42-month reign of the antichrist. Daniel tells us the antichrist will destroy the holy people (Daniel 8:24, Revelation 13:7). He will wear down the saints of the Highest One, waging war against them and overpowering them for three and a half years, until the Lord returns to defeat him, as shown in this passage:

I kept looking, and that horn was waging war with the saints and overpowering them until the Ancient of Days came and judgment was passed in favor of the saints of the Highest One, and the time arrived when the saints took possession of the kingdom. (Daniel 7:21-22)

He will speak out against the Most High and wear down the saints of the Highest One, and he will intend to make alterations in times and in law; and they will be given into his hand for a time, times, and half a time. (Daniel 7:25)

Question: If believers are not on earth during the 42-month reign of the antichrist how can he wage war against them, overpower them, and wear them down?

Answer: He can’t do it if they are already in heaven. Believers must be here during the 42-month reign of the antichrist for these prophecies to be fulfilled.

So believers are still on the earth in Revelation 6, which all by itself debunks the claims made by pre-tribbers. But there is much more evidence because believers are also found in Revelation 7. Verses 1-8 tell us about the 144,000 bond-servants of the Lord who are given a seal on their forehead to protect them from the wrath of God, which is about to be poured out.

Question: Why would they need the seal on their forehead to protect them from the wrath of God if they are not on earth during the outpouring of the wrath of God?

Answer: They are on earth during the outpouring of the wrath of God.

When the fifth trumpet is sounded, locusts are commanded to harm everyone who does not have the seal of God on their forehead.

Then out of the smoke came locusts upon the earth, and power was given them, as the scorpions of the earth have power. They were told not to hurt the grass of the earth, nor any green thing, nor any tree, but only the men who do not have the seal of God on their foreheads. And they were not permitted to kill anyone, but to torment for five months; and their torment was like the torment of a scorpion when it stings a man. (Revelation 9:3-5)

The 144,000 present a real problem for the pre-tribbers, which is why many of them claim these people are not even Christians, but Jews. It is true their heritage is Jewish, but it is also true they are believers in Jesus as their Messiah, and not only believers, but bond-servants who are given great honor not given to any other believers.

Then I looked, and behold, the Lamb was standing on Mount Zion, and with Him one hundred and forty-four thousand, having His name and the name of His Father written on their foreheads. And I heard a voice from heaven, like the sound of many waters and like the sound of loud thunder, and the voice which I heard was like the sound of harpists playing on their harps. And they sang a new song before the throne and before the four living creatures and the elders; and no one could learn the song except the one hundred and forty- four thousand who had been purchased from the earth. These are the ones who have not been defiled with women, for they have kept themselves chaste. These are the ones who follow the Lamb wherever He goes. These have been purchased from among men as first fruits to God and to the Lamb. And no lie was found in their mouth; they are blameless. (Revelation 14:1-5)

Next we find a great multitude which was so great in number that no one could count them. They came from every nation and tribe and people and tongue. We see them standing before the throne of God in heaven in Revelation 7:9-17. That makes the pre-tribbers very happy because the multitude is already in heaven. However, there is a very big problem here because the elder explains to John where these people came from and the things they endured.

And he said to me, “These are the ones who come out of the great tribulation, and they have washed their robes and made them white in the blood of the Lamb. For this reason, they are before the throne of God; and they serve Him day and night in His temple; and He who sits on the throne will spread His tabernacle over them. They will hunger no longer, nor thirst anymore; nor will the sun beat down on them, nor any heat; for the Lamb in the center of the throne will be their shepherd, and will guide them to springs of the water of life; and God will wipe every tear from their eyes.” (Revelation 7:14-17)

Question: How could this great multitude come out of the great tribulation if they were already raptured back in Revelation 4:1?

Answer: They were not raptured in Revelation 4:1. They are still on the earth during the 42-month tribulation and during the first part of the great tribulation. It is impossible to come out of something without first being in it. See my previous post: Twelve Differences Between the Tribulation and Great Tribulation.

The elder’s statement to John also reveals these people endured hunger, thirst, exposure to heat (which would be the case for homeless refugees), and shedding of tears. If they were raptured before the tribulation they would not have endured these things, but since they did endure these things we know they were still here on earth during the tribulation. They were raptured out of the great tribulation, just prior to the outpouring of the wrath of God, just in time to fulfill God’s promise to deliver his people from the wrath to come (1 Thessalonians 1:10).

So they could not have been raptured way back in Revelation 4:1 because that would contradict what the elder told John. They are raptured after the tribulation, just like Jesus said:

“But immediately after the tribulation of those days the sun will be darkened, and the moon will not give its light, and the stars will fall from the sky, and the powers of the heavens will be shaken. And then the sign of the Son of Man will appear in the sky, and then all the tribes of the earth will mourn, and they will see the Son of Man coming on the clouds of the sky with power and great glory. And He will send forth His angels with A great trumpet and they will gather together His elect from the four winds, from one end of the sky to the other.” (Matthew 24:29-31)

Amazingly, his statement that it happens AFTER the tribulation fits perfectly with what Daniel saw with the antichrist waging war against the saints for three and a half years. It also fits perfectly with what John saw with the saints killed for their faith after the fifth seal is broken then raptured after the seventh seal is broken.

Now we can move on to the next mention of believers on earth after the start of the tribulation, which is found in Revelation 14.

Here is the perseverance of the saints who keep the commandments of God and their faith in Jesus. And I heard a voice from heaven, saying, “Write, ‘Blessed are the dead who die in the Lord from now on!’” “Yes,” says the Spirit, “so that they may rest from their labors, for their deeds follow with them.” (Revelation 14:12-13)

We know these people are believers because we are told the following five facts about them.

  1. The keep the commandments
  2. They keep their faith
  3. They are blessed
  4. They will die in the Lord from after that point
  5. They will rest from their labors

So the good news is these people are going to heaven when they die. The bad news is they will suffer greatly and many of them will ultimately be killed because they missed the rapture altogether. We know they will not be raptured at the end either because we are told they are going to die in the Lord. People taken in the rapture do not die, but are transformed from mortality to immortality in an instant. So this provides yet another mention of believers on earth during the tribulation and great tribulation and proves there will not be a second rapture at the end of the great tribulation.

The pre-tribbers teach there is one rapture before the tribulation and another one at the end, which means the Lord would have to return two more times, not once. There would have to be a second and a third coming, not just a second coming. There are no scriptures to support any of that, but there are lots of scriptures proving it is false. The only way to see the second rapture and third coming is to bend way over and, you know what.

Conclusion:

This is not written to start a debate or to make entertainment, but to expose a dangerous lie that I believe could cause many to spend eternity in hell.

I hate seeing nice people go out of their way to get cleaned up and dressed up just so they can go get messed up listening to some pre-trib teacher. I personally have friends who are hoping for the rapture to deliver them from the trouble, which is now coming upon the world, because they have been taught the lie of the pre-trib rapture. The reality is trouble is coming and they will still be here because according to the Bible there are many things that must happen before the rapture, including major events that take many years to unfold. See my previous post, Ten Things that Must Happen Before the Rapture.

When trouble comes and these misguided saints find themselves still here their faith will come under attack as they realize they have believed a lie. Then they will be forced to sort out whether or not they can still believe anything from the Bible. Even in the best of times that would be very hard, but during a time of crisis it could be more than their faith can handle.

A great falling away from the faith is coming, and I believe this false doctrine will be to blame for many souls spending eternity in hell (2 Thessalonians 2:3, 1 Timothy 4:1-3), but we don’t have to be part of it. We still have a window of opportunity, a little time left, to study the scriptures and to diligently seek the Lord so when trouble comes we will be well prepared.

Our faith is our most valuable possession because it is our ticket to eternal life, so we should give it the attention it deserves by studying these things for ourselves rather than just relying on someone else to explain it.

In conclusion, the rapture is not nearly as complicated as pre-tribbers make it out to be. The Lord gave it to us simple, not complicated, because he wants us to know these things. Scriptures that describe the rapture really are talking about the rapture! Scriptures that don’t even mention the rapture are not talking about the rapture! Scriptures we don’t understand only require a little extra digging because other scriptures explain them. It’s not complicated!

See more End-Time Bible study topics.

James Bailey

Author: James Bailey

James Bailey is a blogger, business owner, husband and father of two grown children. In 1982, he surrendered his life to the Lord Jesus Christ. In 2012, he founded Z3news.com to broadcast the message of salvation by reporting end time news before it happens.

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avis swope
Member
August 28, 2015 5:22 AM

I BELIEVE WHAT PERRY STONE PREACHES ON PRETRIB .
HE MAKES IR CLEAR TO UNDERSTAND ABOUT PRETRIB.
HE ALSO USES SCRIPTURE TO BACK IT UP.
PERRY STONE IS THE TEACHER & AUTHOR & EVANGELIST ON HIS PROGRAM MANIFEST
OR http://WWW.VOE.ORG.
YOU CAN ALSO WATCH HIM ON WWW> YOU TUBE.COM.

Lori
Lori
Member
August 29, 2015 12:59 AM

Avis Swope, I go to Perry Stones church, OCI, and love him dearly. His heart is amazing.
However, his view on pretrib is backed by his study of the ancient traditional Jewish wedding. I bought his study and looked into it myself and found many holes in it. I have never found one single scripture that supports a secret rapture. He does not come 3 times. He comes “immediately AFTER the tribulation” Math 24.
I suggest you study to show yourself approved. I love Perry, but I love my Lord more. He is the one I follow.

Lydia Hodge
Lydia Hodge
Member
July 18, 2016 10:49 AM

I love Perry Stone as well as many of the Pretrib teachers. I have been well schooled in the Tim LaHaye rapture teaching and for many years I have held to this view. Last summer I was listening to a testimony on Tru News of a young woman named Mena Grebin discussing how God had showed her things concerning the seals being broken. It resonated with me and later as I was studying on the return of Christ I noticed (even though it has always been there) when Christ ascended to Heaven in a cloud the angel said this same Jesus will come back in the same way you have seen him go. And other places it says behold he comes with clouds, every eye shall see him. It’s just like oh it made sense all of a sudden, there is no secret rapture it just isn’t there. Wow, help us all to not be deceived.

Cie
Cie
Member
April 3, 2017 11:24 AM
Hi Lori, may I add a few thoughts to your post? I believe as we are approaching the time of prophetic fulfillment, more revelation is given to us just as Daniel states in 12:4 [KJV]) …seal the book, [even] to the time of the end: many shall run to and fro, and knowledge shall be increased. I recently learned that Jesus has returned a couple of times already. Remember when He was just risen and Mary found Him in the garden? John 20:17 [KJV] Jesus saith unto her, Touch me not; for I am not yet ascended to my Father: but go to my brethren, and say unto them, I ascend unto my Father, and your Father; and [to] my God, and your God. Here we have a period of about 12 hours, in the morning Jesus told Mary, “don’t touch me, I have not yet ascended to the Father” and deliver the pure sacrifice to the throne of God. And then that same day at evening, Jesus returns and appears to all of the disciples. John 20:19 [KJV] Then the same day at evening, being the first [day] of the week, when the doors were shut where the disciples were assembled for fear of the Jews, came Jesus and stood in the midst, and saith unto them, Peace [be] unto you. So at that point He did come twice already. So the notion of He not coming 3 times does already not add up. The third coming is next in line, but it is not the one ‘immediately after’ the tribulation, that would be His last coming. Matthew 24:29 speaks of the final return of Jesus to earth, and pay attention to who is coming with Him. Matt 24:29 [KJV]) Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the… Read more »
Cynthia mae Curran
Member
September 30, 2016 11:10 AM

Corie Ten Boom actually brought back what the Chinese Church said that the pre-trib rapture didn’t strengthen people for persecution and many left their faith when the communist took over.

James
James
Member
December 28, 2015 12:43 PM

Satan is the great deceiver. The father of lies. Imagine for a moment one of the greatest lies in history. A false doctrine that would result in millions of Christians turning away from God and end up in hell. The lie? “Don’t fear! have faith! You do not need to worry! God is going to rapture you before the tribulation comes! God wouldn’t let you suffer. God loves you and He will save you” The BEST lies have a dabbling of the “Truth”. Of course, it makes perfect sense. “Thank you Lord! I am so happy I don’t have to go through the tribulation”!!! “I am so happy I don’t have to be killed for my faith”!!! “I am so happy I wont go through the most devastating time in history, that’s for the godless heathens that turned away from you Lord”. Now the tribulation starts, millions die of starvation, nuclear war, rape, riots, murder on a scale never seen before!!!
“WHAT!!!! I wasn’t supposed to be here for this!!!! God where are you??? Why have you forsaken me??? Maybe you aren’t real!!!! Maybe everything I was taught was a lie”????? Now enter the Anti-Christ with his deception and lies, his miracles and lying signs and wonders……..that believe, “Oh!!!! LOOK!!!! This is the true God, this is our savior”!!!!! and BAM!!!!! To hell they go……………….millions. This is why it is so very important to get the word out about the lie that is the pre-trib rapture!!!!!!!! (( I know I don’t have the big words, or the flowery language skills that most of you do so please forgive my crude writing ))

n.s.
n.s.
Member
December 28, 2015 5:01 PM

I have heard several well known pastors say that GOD loves them too much to allow them to go through anything horrible when discussing endtime events or asked what they think or believe about endtime events. I recently listened to a pastor on the radio make a joke by declaring he was going up in the rapture before anything bad happens because he is a ‘fraidy cat. WHAT??? I could hear the congregation laughing and hee hawing at his statement. It was funny to them and clearly not something they should even give a second thought to. I once heard someone say that congregations will be physically dragging their pastors/preachers into the street when they realize just how wrong they were. Its sad how many refuse to even question if maybe they have it all wrong.

Daniel
Daniel
Member
September 12, 2015 2:09 PM

To be brief, the pretrib rapture is an explicit “Massive Deception” from Hell; God showed me this term 4 years ago. It basically is all about an aversion to persecution. A bloodless false Gospel absent of ‘Any” suffering. However: Mat 5:10 Blessed are they which are persecuted for righteousness’ sake: for theirs is the kingdom of heaven.
Mat 5:11 Blessed are ye, when men shall revile you, and persecute you, and shall say all manner of evil against you falsely, for my sake.
Mat 5:12 Rejoice, and be exceeding glad: for great is your reward in heaven: for so persecuted they the prophets which were before you.
2Ti 3:12 Yea, and all that will live godly in Christ Jesus shall suffer persecution.
Mat 20:22 But Jesus answered and said, Ye know not what ye ask. Are ye able to drink of the cup that I shall drink of, and to be baptized with the baptism that I am baptized with? They say unto him, We are able.
Mat 26:27 And he took the cup, and gave thanks, and gave it to them, saying, Drink ye all of it;
Mat 26:39 And he went a little further, and fell on his face, and prayed, saying, O my Father, if it be possible, let this cup pass from me: nevertheless not as I will, but as thou wilt.
No Pain, No Gain…God Bless, DaniEl

Delia Smith
Delia Smith
Member
December 28, 2015 8:09 PM

It is almost a prideful stance that defies the Bibles verses stating that you will suffer persecution as a Christian. It is a slap in the face of those martyrs in the Middle East. Young children refused to deny Christ and were murdered and beheaded yet a grown man ….a pastor claims he will not suffer because is a “too afraid”. Shameful.

Cie
Cie
Member
April 3, 2017 10:15 AM

Delia, persecution is promised to all those who proclaim the gospel in truth. The fact that we are not persecuted here in the western culture, is probably due to the fact that we are not preaching the gospel and turning the world upside down. We try to do things the ‘polite’ way here. I am guilty of that, hands down. But that has nothing to do with the period called Jacob’s trouble or the tribulation. This is a completely different scenario, and one we are about to enter into this fall 2017.

n.s.
n.s.
Member
December 28, 2015 9:59 PM

Just this morning, I read a story about a kid in Staten Island that while walking to school back in January was attacked…but survived. In a neighbors home surveillance video it appeared to NYPD detectives that the perp was trying to decapitate this 9 year old kid from behind while holding him in a chokehold. Well long story short, this guy was arrested for plotting to blow up Times Square BEFORE they ever even identified him as the one who tried to murder this kid. The Feds have had him in custody since earlier this year and NYPD can’t touch him for attempting to behead this little boy. There was one other sentence in the article that really frightens me, that this was possibly ISIS recruitment related. I think the radicals are ready to do what they do best and thats–KILL. Pretending we can’t really be touched by this on a mass scale in America is just not logical thinking. Obama says its a religion of peace…..I say its a religion of pieces, blown and stabbed to pieces. Sorry if that sounds sarcastic or flippant, I’m not trying to be.

Delia Smith
Delia Smith
Member
December 25, 2015 11:06 AM

Sorry on my last post I should have reviewed it 1st. I meant…..both believers & non-believers are supposed to see the Lord at the 2nd coming according to the bible…..not a secret 2nd coming. Also the bible seems to support a post-trib 2nd coming more than any other point in time.

Delia Smith
Delia Smith
Member
December 25, 2015 10:26 AM
Hello. I have been wrestling with the rapture issue for quite awhile since most of my family and friends still believe in the pre-tribulation rapture but I do not. The book of Revelation gives the promise of a blessing to those who read & study it and a curse to those who try to add or take away from it. Also only one 2nd coming is described in the Bible. The Christians being persecuted now are exceeding those of the early church so therefore why hasn’t the rapture occurred yet if the pre-trib rapture is true? Those who talk about “tribulation saints” also believe the Holy Spirit is removed during the tribulation so if that is true then how can anyone be saved then? The “144,000” marked that they claim to be Jews from the 12 tribes may be true but there will be gentiles during this time that will be saved also I believe. Some Christians during the tribulation will make great exploits and bring others to Christ while many will fall by the sword and be purified and made white according the the book of Daniel. Also unless those days were shortened even the elect would not survive. The deceit will be so strong & convincing that even the elect might be deceived were it not for the Holy Spirit to give them discernment. Paul refers to the elect as all believers not just the Jews or “tribulation Saints”. Jesus said every eye will see and hear him at his 2nd coming so how can the pre-trib rapture be believed at all since no believers will not see him at that time according to that premise? The bible doesn’t supports either a pre-wrath or post-trib meeting of the Lord in the sky after the dead rise to meet… Read more »
Dolph
Dolph
Member
August 29, 2015 6:54 PM

God provided an escape for the Jews out of Egypt, for the Noah and believers the first time He judged the world, for Abraham, Lot and family out of Sodom, believers before the trib, “When Christ who is our life appears, then you also will appear with Him in glory.” Col.3:4 God bless, Dolph

James
James
Member
December 28, 2015 12:27 PM

Dolph, ALL of those people you mentioned still had to go through the troubled time. God didn’t TAKE THEM OUT, He guided them through it!!!!!!!!

Robert Adolph
Robert Adolph
Member
December 28, 2015 3:23 PM

James, what Noah and family on the ark went through was nothing compared to Jacob’s Trouble. What is coming up has been called the second holocaust for the Jews. God took real good care of Noah and family the first time He judged the world and He is no respecter of persons. Yes, tribulation saints will go through many troubles but the Church, Jesus’ bride, is “not appointed unto wrath… wherefore comfort yourselves together”, 1Thes.5:9,11. The Jews, however, are “vessels of wrath”, Rom. 9:22. I have made provisions for what is coming because I haven’t been informed of the day of the rapture which I am also prepared for. I just placed another order with Sam’s Club this morning for powdered milk, oats, corn meal, powered eggs and 36 cans of Sterno, not to mention 8 bags of dog food. I am very familiar with what the Germans went through in WW II.

Debra Walker
Contributor
August 29, 2015 7:31 PM

Dolph, with respect, I don’t understand; can you explain? Yes, we will appear with Christ in glory when He appears. It seems you mean that He will return before the tribulation, yes? But He returns for the battle of Armageddon, and that Must come after the tribulation. Zechariah 14:3-9 (NIV; I think this is the translation you are using) “Then the LORD will go out and fight against those nations, as He fights on a day of battle. On that day His feet will stand on the Mount of Olives, east of Jerusalem, and the Mount of Olives will be split in two from east to west, forming a great valley, with half of the mountain moving north and half moving south. You will not flee by My mountain valley, for it will extend to Azel. You will flee as you fled from the earthquake in the days of Uzziah king of Judah. Then the LORD my God will come, and all the holy ones with him. On that day there will be neither sunlight nor cold, frosty darkness. It will be a unique day – a day known only to the LORD – with no distinction between day and night. When evening comes, there will be light. On that day living water will flow out from Jerusalem, half of it east to the Dead Sea and half of it west to the Mediterranean Sea, in summer and in winter. The LORD will be king over the whole earth. On that day there will be one LORD, and His name the only name.” Dolph, regardless whether we ever see eye to eye on this nonessential-for-salvation issue, I receive the blessings of God that you sent, and likewise release God’s blessings to you. Shalom and Selah.

John
John
Member
August 28, 2015 2:26 PM

First Christ must come IN US: – first, we have to become the glorious church on earth displaying the full works of Jesus in us and through us overcoming all the power of the enemy and reaping the end time harvest.

Then Christ will come FOR US: – “the bride has made herself ready”.

Then Christ will come WITH US: – Jude 1 :14 “See, the Lord is coming with thousands upon thousands of his holy ones to judge everyone, and to convict all of them of all the ungodly acts they have committed in their ungodliness, and of all the defiant words ungodly sinners have spoken against him.”

Darryl
Darryl
Member
August 28, 2015 1:02 PM

Hey James, another excellent article. I believe God is waking us up to His Truth & delivering us from all the false doctrines of demons found in religion. As we truly give up everything & seek His Face, God will lead us out of Bablylon & into His Promise Land. I believe God is raising up Leaders, True Shepherds like Christ Jesus, that will lead the Remnant & all who want the Truth into His Paradise, even though it be through tribulation that we have never experienced, especially us in America. No food, no electricity, nothing but destruction until America is completely destroyed, with a very small remnant left. Are there any “Moses'” out there prepared to lead & to fully establish the Kingdom of Christ Jesus in this land? Just something God has placed on my heart lately. ‘He who overcomes, (YOU!) and he who keeps My deeds until the end, (YOU!) to him (YOU!) I will give authority over the nations & he (YOU!) shall rule them with a rod of iron,.. Rev 2:26,27 Are you prepared to lead like Moses & ready to Shepherd like Christ? God Bless you & yours.

Cie
Cie
Member
April 3, 2017 11:00 AM
Hi Darryl, I would just like to add a thought to your comment above. You quoted, “He who overcomes, (YOU!) and he who keeps My deeds until the end, (YOU!) to him (YOU!) I will give authority over the nations & he (YOU!) shall rule them with a rod of iron,.. Rev 2:26,27″. It’s been 2 years since this comment was posted, and a lot has happened since. Blood moons, the Bethlehem star and now this year the Revelation 12 great sign in the heavens. I would like to point out something from Revelation 12. Rev 12:4 [KJV]) And his tail drew the third part of the stars of heaven, and did cast them to the earth: and the dragon stood before the woman which was ready to be delivered, for to devour her child as soon as it was born. Rev 12:5 [KJV]) And she brought forth a man child, who was to rule all nations with a rod of iron: and her child was caught up unto God, and [to] his throne. It is interesting that the phrase “rod of iron” appears there again. We need to ask ourselves then, who is this CHILD? We can pretty well say that Rev 12 does not speak about Jesus’ birth 2000 years ago, since Revelation is a futuristic prophecy written about 100 years later. Scott Clarke on Youtube has an interesting interpretation on this. He believes the male child is the ‘body’ of Christ that was conceived at Pentecost, and is to be birthed this fall. The head (Christ) is already at the throne of God, but the body has to be joined to the head yet. Therefore, this male child appears to be the church to be born and caught up (harpazo) to the throne of God, for to… Read more »
Cie
Cie
Member
April 3, 2017 11:04 AM

I do want to state this, that when we say the church gets caught up to God, it is unrealistic to think that it includes everyone who calls themselves a Christian. Obviously, Jesus put some conditions on who will be accounted worthy to escape all these things and who won’t. Think 5 wise and 5 foolish virgins. This implies that half the church will probably go through the tribulation for further purification. After the feast of trumpets is fulfilled, there remain two more feasts… atonement and tabernacles. Atonement will occur during the tribulation, and this is a period mainly for Israel (Jacob’s trouble) but the foolish virgins will also be there.

Andrew
Member
August 28, 2015 9:12 AM

I will never understand is it really really really necessary have a big argument whether its pre-trib or mid or post trib…

clearly its not POST tribulation according to the visions and scriptures.. leaving either its pre or mid trib rapture.. however.. I respect both sides because.. everyone is entitled to their own opinion and interpretation.

this is not as fatal as unbiblical doctrines out there like worshipping Mary, hating sinners, prosperity gospel, once saved always saved, etc. because either its pre trib or mid trib.. we will live holy, be ready as the bride, preach the gospel of Jesus Christ to sinners and unbelievers..

I believe in pre-trib.. but I am also ready for a mid trib.. because I do not want to lean on my own understanding, I am ready for the outcome either way.

Tiffanie
Tiffanie
Member
January 8, 2016 6:39 PM

I agree Andrew!

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